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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
i worked with another taper for a few days last summer. he was a straight mesh taper. one thing he did that i had never seen was pre-filling before laying mesh tape. next we went around and wiped out the mesh with a thin layer of 90 just to imbed the tape. after that it was just two premix coats as usual. it was an odd method to me because i had always assumed the reason people use mesh is to try and skip a coat not to do just as many coats as i would with paper. so i was wondering if there was anyone else who pre- fills before laying mesh. i have started doing it too cause it makes sense to me that no matter what kind of tape i am using i want it to be flat as possible not sucked into a wide open joint. my method now is i pre fill. let set. then with new batch, lay tape and then bed right away( only with mesh not paper).

if the paper police could please abstain from turining this into another mesh/paper war that would be super. we all allready know who you are and what you think.
 

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papertaper here but do use mesh from time to time, we always will prefill with hotmud when using mesh. We dont wait to dry tho,we just fill,put on mesh,wipe and throw a coat...turn around and top it:thumbsup:
 

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there are many reason why to pre-fill when using paper. But does not Mesh have holes in it, and you half to use hotmud with it. Sorta pointless to prefill with it, since to state the obvious again, mesh has holes in it,,,, so......:whistling2:
 

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there are many reason why to pre-fill when using paper. But does not Mesh have holes in it, and you half to use hotmud with it. Sorta pointless to prefill with it, since to state the obvious again, mesh has holes in it,,,, so......:whistling2:
....so does paper
 
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I don't prefill when using mesh, because I want the mud surrounding the tape, from the same batch. I will if it's a big hole and the mesh will buckle when mudded, but otherwise, no. If I'm going to use mud to lay tape, it's going to be paper or Fuse (been using Fuse lately).
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
papertaper here but do use mesh from time to time, we always will prefill with hotmud when using mesh. We dont wait to dry tho,we just fill,put on mesh,wipe and throw a coat...turn around and top it:thumbsup:
that sounds pretty much the exact same as i've been doing it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
2buck, the reason i was wondering was because of that info from usg about how mesh gets its strength from the expansion of the hotmud putting tension on it. so i guess the point of this thread is i was intending to point out how when using mesh on a joint with a big gap and the hotmud shrinks back you now have a puckered tape that has lost the only strength it was supposed to gain. hence the prefill.

hey slim, do you v out your joints before using mesh?

i've been v'ing out all my butt joints lately and prefilling no matter what i am taping with. it seems worthwhile to me because it feels like good insurance. i am feeling much more confident about the strength of my joints. i never thought it mattered but now that i've started doing it i don't think i'll go back. i always used to think it was some crazy time-wasting idea that a bunch of old neurotic tapers on here had. i really do feel the flatter the tape and the more mud in the joint the stronger the joint is.
 

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2buck, the reason i was wondering was because of that info from usg about how mesh gets its strength from the expansion of the hotmud putting tension on it. so i guess the point of this thread is i was intending to point out how when using mesh on a joint with a big gap and the hotmud shrinks back you now have a puckered tape that has lost the only strength it was supposed to gain. hence the prefill.

hey slim, do you v out your joints before using mesh?

i've been v'ing out all my butt joints lately and prefilling no matter what i am taping with. it seems worthwhile to me because it feels like good insurance. i am feeling much more confident about the strength of my joints. i never thought it mattered but now that i've started doing it i don't think i'll go back. i always used to think it was some crazy time-wasting idea that a bunch of old neurotic tapers on here had. i really do feel the flatter the tape and the more mud in the joint the stronger the joint is.
Yeah, I 'V' them, but I only put a micro bevel on them, enough to get rid of any loose paper and crumbly rock. I've been going kinda overkill on my butts lately...I even go so far as to remove all the dust now (with a wet sponge or even some water & glue mixed together if I'm concerned). I had a joint crack a while back, after paint, and my only conclusion was that the mud hadn't bonded to the rock properly. It looked like failure at the point where mud and rock meet. V'd it more, washed it with water and glue, taped it with Fibafuse and setmud/glue. Didn't crack again, I just looked at it the other day and the repair was made in January.
 

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I've been prepping every butt joint for some time now... allways removing loose paper and prefilling them. I also use the fibatape as you mentioned above... although I only use fibatape for smaller jobs... like, 10 sheets or less, and for the butt joints I double it up .... I was having a problem with hairline cracks on butt joints with the fibatape... but since I doubled up the tape I dont. (its really 'if' and 'when' I use fibatape though)
 

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When we did fiber tape. Still due for small jobs
I remember when we first started with it we would get hair
line On the buts ,so we started cutting v in them pre filling we only use hot mud on mesh. But still would get hair lines ( I think if it's cold bit I don't help)
So we only use mesh for flats the buts and conners we use paper
I think mesh is ok in the bevels only ( that's my opinion :)
When I work in Florida for a few years that was over20 years ago
I remember they use to mesh everything and no hot mud regular mud they use
But I think because is so warm down there they could get away with it
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
it sounds like we are all on the same page. i have only had one crack(that i know of) and fortunately i caught it on sand day. it was a butt to bevel joint over a doorway(no big suprise). this was a couple of years ago when i was less informed.
i agree with the crack forming where the mud meets the rock. i'm pretty sure thats almost always where they are with mesh on butts.. paper would hide those for at least a few years i would think if not indefinately. cracks in a flat joint with mesh i think have to come from quite a bit of stress. i'd be willing to bet you could skip the tape and use hotmud on flats and have most of them not crack. not that i am in any way suggesting it. emphasis on the word MOST of them. 9 out of ten is not bad for some things but for a taper it just won't do.
 

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Sorry Carp dont agree. Would you pour a concrete slab without steel mesh? I think not. For the same reason I would not set joints without tape at all. After all if we did that we would be fillers not tapers.:yes:
 

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Sorry Carp dont agree. Would you pour a concrete slab without steel mesh? I think not. For the same reason I would not set joints without tape at all. After all if we did that we would be fillers not tapers.:yes:
I dont agree either, I would bet that within 12 months of a home getting built going thru 4 seasons 9 out of ten seams with no tape would crack.

Mesh :hang: Why oh why??????????????????????????????????
 

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Something must definitely be wrong with Capt.....A mesh thread should attract him like a bear to honey :huh:

I know, Ive been holding back doing an impression of him.

Like Dern man, Mesh isnt even any good to wipe your backside crack with.

If mesh could open a beer then it might have some use.

If i see a crack, tape it, and i still see a crack, Then its still cracked
(No wait, that one might be moores)

But i wont, Cause carpy will tell me off :thumbup:
 

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2buck, the reason i was wondering was because of that info from usg about how mesh gets its strength from the expansion of the hotmud putting tension on it. so i guess the point of this thread is i was intending to point out how when using mesh on a joint with a big gap and the hotmud shrinks back you now have a puckered tape that has lost the only strength it was supposed to gain. hence the prefill.
Sounds like you answered your own question :yes::whistling2:
 
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