[2buckcanuck]

seen no thread on this so,and off early today so.....
just me (answer from sanding thread)

"I tried the Cam-Am applicator for bead installs, using a Can-Am tube. Not much luck with those applicators, either, although when I stripped it down some it worked better. Still have to try the new Columbia bead applicator I got, with the new Columbia tube. Nice tube."
guessing you took the "v" thing off that can am applicator,put it back on,you will go through too much mud,use a mud mix that is around 4 coffee cups,runny/stiff mud if that makes sense .when doing a 8' stand up bead,start from middle then go down,then from middle and go up,do same with the horizontals till you get the hang of it.Plus if your new to compound tube,(not sure) there's a bend on the head,just like the bend in a angle head pole/handle.that has to be held just right (square)to run properly also,not sure about the mud runner if it has the bend ????? A bead roller is a must!!!
only down fall with the bead applicator is it's contingent upon the drywall job you must follow,for example,if your doing a 2x4 arch way,rockers use to put on 4"1/4 drywall returns with metal bead.now with paper beads it should be a 4"1/2 to 4"5/8 return,anything less you will get mud all over the place,especially on horizontal beads.drywallers should be on same page with you any how,if your using paper bead:yes:
bead applicator blows a bead box out of the water in production and cleanliness hands down.
Plus if you really want a bead box,you can make one in a pinch with a mud box and a scrap bead,it's disposable of coarse ,why pay money for one

 

[JustMe]

Since this thread is dedicated to me - - a long reply:

guessing you took the "v" thing off that can am applicator,put it back on,you will go through too much mud

I hear you, and it's appreciated.

But the mud is supplied to me. My bigger concern is how long does it take to dry behind the bead, when you dump a bunch of mud into the corner gaps made when (usually) using 5/8" board.

Regarding the applicator itself, my thoughts after trying it was to not use the thing at all.

It wasn't my applicator, but another guy's. I borrowed it, so I could try it for a few beads (tried giving it back to him last Friday, but he said not to worry about it - which means he's not into using it much, either). But its design didn't seem to make sense enough, at least not for 5/8" board. I did take the v thing off, and a couple other things. It still didn't work acceptably enough to me, but I got some ideas as to what I'd do differently with it, if I wanted to get my machinist involved.

when doing a 8' stand up bead,start from middle then go down,then from middle and go up,do same with the horizontals till you get the hang of it.

That's the way I came to usually doing such things. Got onto doing it like that when putting mud in corners with a tube, so they could be flushed a 2nd time (I use both corner box and applicator tube, with separate flushing when using applicator tube, for 2nd coating corners). The bit of extra time doing it like that, vs. coming up off the floor and running all the way up (we're into t-bar ceilings usually), I find is made up for in better having the right amount of mud to work with.

not sure about the mud runner if it has the bend ????? A bead roller is a must!!!

Mudrunner has a bend. Bead roller is optional to me. I worked out another way of doing it that I found works better in most cases. At least it does for me, in most of my cases.

only down fall with the bead applicator is it's contingent upon the drywall job you must follow,for example,if your doing a 2x4 arch way,rockers use to put on 4"1/4 drywall returns with metal bead.now with paper beads it should be a 4"1/2 to 4"5/8 return,anything less you will get mud all over the place,especially on horizontal beads.drywallers should be on same page with you any how,if your using paper bead:yes:

Yeah, it's another thing on my 'creative hit list', to maybe try and problem solve.

bead applicator blows a bead box out of the water in production and cleanliness hands down.
Plus if you really want a bead box,you can make one in a pinch with a mud box and a scrap bead,it's disposable of coarse ,why pay money for one

Never tried a bead box before. The company's field supervisor gave me one the other day, from their tool crib. They haven't used it and another one in some time, and he's interested in seeing what I might be able to do with it, to see if they could be made more viable to use. I'm going to play with it a bit, when a job comes up that halfway warrants pulling it out, to see what its strengths and weaknesses really are.

 

[2buckcanuck]

bullet point answers from me,slow typer
#1 you only half to worry about the paper sticking with paper bead,not the metal part of it,would you stick a metal bead on with mud,no....so put the paper thing back on,and yes design could be a bit better,block square hole on a$$ end of it
#2 we flush that way too,takes longer but leaves nice finish,more easy on body too
#3 bead roller a must to me,worked on one job with a bunch of french hand tapers,out of all my toys,they liked the bead roller,they all bought one.and if my labourer puts bead on without one,i will blow a gasket
#4 this is up to the drywaller,not the taper,unless your doing rock.would need a diagram to explain better,the steel of paper bead has to be touching the drywall to have strenght,cant be floating ,know what i mean???
#5if your a fat bugger,you will lose lots of weight with all the walking you half to do,Gee maybe I should get one........Plus I can't stand mud on my hands.....yeap ,I'm one of those type of tapers:icon_cry:

 

[2buckcanuck]

is this the app that your talking about justme http://www.canamtool.com/products/disambigAppHeads

 

[JustMe]

you only half to worry about the paper sticking with paper bead,not the metal part of it,would you stick a metal bead on with mud,no....so put the paper thing back on,and yes design could be a bit better,block square hole on a$$ end of it

5/8" board being used mostly, cut by boarders who sometimes aren't careful enough about their corner fitting. I do have to concern myself some at times with support for the metal bead part.

My new Columbia outside applicator seems to be designed for some corner gap filling. Haven't used it yet.

bead roller a must to me,worked on one job with a bunch of french hand tapers,out of all my toys,they liked the bead roller,they all bought one.and if my labourer puts bead on without one,i will blow a gasket

Bead rollers rarely get used by the tapers I work with. Most don't own one. Company has a couple. They use knives to fit things. Some are good at it, some should be using a roller.

I have a couple rollers. But I have my own way of doing things that causes me to not care if I use them too often. I can consistently quickly and accurately put bead on tighter than the rollers will, which means quicker drying, less shrinkage, less 'ski slope' corner shape, less mud, less feathering for me.

this is up to the drywaller,not the taper,unless your doing rock.would need a diagram to explain better,the steel of paper bead has to be touching the drywall to have strenght,cant be floating ,know what i mean???

I'm believing I understand. My point was coming from a 'designing a way forward, while leaving a problem in place' direction. If some boarders won't do their job properly at times, then I want a way to effectively address that.

if your a fat bugger,you will lose lots of weight with all the walking you half to do,Gee maybe I should get one........Plus I can't stand mud on my hands.....yeap ,I'm one of those type of tapers:icon_cry:

Why so much extra walking? Maybe it's the job types(?) On many of our jobs, we can do a lot of walking as it is.

I can get into the mud and not have it bother me - unless it steadily tries dropping on my head, like today, while fire taping some ceilings. I vote for a mud flow control on bazookas.

 

[JustMe]

is this the app that your talking about justme http://www.canamtool.com/products/disambigAppHeads

Of the 5-6 shown there, this one: http://www.canamtool.com/products/prodOSCrnrApp

 

[D's]

Coincidence...

I bought one of those Can-am applicators to try three years ago when I was just getting into the applicator tubes and I put it away on the second day. Just couldn't get it to feed right. I pulled it out yesterday to try with the Apla CFS and it still gave crappy results... until I removed the metal strip in the middle that diverts the mud out to the edges. Once removed any gap at the point of the corner gets filled as well as a nice bed on both sides for the paper. Makes for a solid bond and now it's staying in the tool box.

I tried the roller again with it but still no good. It's messy and doesn't do any better than good pressure, wiggle back and forth, and a tight wipe with a knife.

Up until yesterday I was using a bead box but no longer. Now I just pull the taper off and attach the corner applicator. Hopefully I have as much luck with the flat applicator for doing offsets.

D'S

 

[cazna]

I have both those can am heads and the white plastic mud heads, I have found the mud heads better, much easier the slide in the corners and a nicer bead of mud to work with.

 

[2buckcanuck]

justme
not arguing with you,just tossing out ideas ,methods,here we go
were spoiled by some very good drywallers where we are,but if we must repair a bead where the metal touches no drywall.Fire 2 flat tapes on the bad side,leaving a fill of mud between the 2 tapes.your making a mini sheet of drywall,I call it a Chinese wall.down fall is it's best to let it dry 1st before you install bead,or pull out your hot muds to do it.or fire a blob of mud with your knife,8" to 12" on corner of rock,no need to do whole bead ,over kill,use b1U bead instead of b1 w's,B1U's the metal is wider,but they take a bit more mud to fill,not too much more
watch what roller you use http://www.canamtool.com/products/prodStdOSCrnrRoll these ones seem like a all purpose roller,while these ones suck http://www.tapetechtools.com/drywal...l/better-than-ever-outside-corner-roller.html Plus some rollers are meant for bull nose bead,you push in hard with the roller ,so the bead will go on tight,and the roller replaces your puddy knife,After you roll ,try wiping your bead down with a sponge (messy floors though) if you like that then buy a sponge mop with a hand crank http://www.google.ca/#hl=en&source=...=g9g-m1&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=&fp=4aeaa14e93ada747 Lets just say when I was in T.O. for a while,in high rises ,we put on 600 beads one day,we were told the next day to slow down,the guy who normally did the installs was on holidays,he used a bead box and wiped by hand.the foreman liked the guy,did not want to see him lose his job so.....we complied
fire the dry wallers,gets a point across real fast,or back charge them
and too much walking with bead box,you can cut down some walking if you put it on a mini baker ,but you always need to be set up in a big room,8' bead goes in,8' bead comes out,need a room with 18' clearance,including bead box.I would compare a bead box to a tv without a remote,with out the remote you half to walk to the tv to change channels all the time,same as the bead box,your always walking to it,get what I mean

 

[JustMe]

I know you're not arguing, and know a long post like that is a little painful to a slow typer. So thanks, 2buck.

I did type out a bit of a lengthy reply, but this site ate it again, when I tried to preview it. So I'll just assimilate your words of wisdom quietly.

 

[JustMe]

I tried the roller again with it but still no good. It's messy

One way I found to get around the messy, is to roll slower, and have a bit of water in a bucket to wash it between beads. When I wash(ed) it, I'd bang it a bit on the bottom. Like I do the corner roller, to clean the taping mud off it while rolling, and to clean it off after I'm done with it.

 

[JustMe]

doesn't do any better than good pressure, wiggle back and forth, and a tight wipe with a knife.

One problem I find with wiggling is it can create a separation between the metal, the paper, and the mud underneath, and things can happen like the paper bubbling.

One thing I've done to reduce that is to use 2 knives, usually my 6" and 3", to center/position the bead on the corner. I'll push in on the bead with a knife on each side at the same time, till it's in place - kind of like bead rolling, but without the roller.

Then I'll use my 3" to wipe. My 6" will serve as a place to put the excess mud till I can transfer it to my pan.

 

[McDusty]

if you are having problems with applicator heads... it might not be the heads, it might be the tube.

i had a can-am tube for awhile and it is to hard to push and get consistant pressure. i've tried about 7 various can-am tubes and they are all like that.

enter the Better-Than-Ever tube. butter baby, butter. so easy to push and achieve desired pressure with minimal effort.

the test: pull the piston all the way out, rest your tube against the wall with the handle on the ground, and the head against the wall. your can am will not push the piston in, the B-T-E will.

it was a game changer for me.

 

[2buckcanuck]

well,guess i know who made my tube now,here's link http://www.betterthanevertools.com/...le=5&name=Compound_Tubes&category=Applicators
:whistling2:

 

[JustMe]

i had a can-am tube for awhile and it is to hard to push and get consistant pressure. i've tried about 7 various can-am tubes and they are all like that.

enter the Better-Than-Ever tube. butter baby, butter. so easy to push and achieve desired pressure with minimal effort.

the test: pull the piston all the way out, rest your tube against the wall with the handle on the ground, and the head against the wall. your can am will not push the piston in, the B-T-E will.

it was a game changer for me.

Or try the new Columbia tube. Looser than Can-Am, but tight enough where it counts. Smooth once get mud into it. Nice.

-------

Post 200! I would like a Columbia 6' bent box handle for a prize.

 

[McDusty]

i do love the look of the columbia tube, and would love to have one *hint, hint, columbia tool giveaway, hint hint*, but i am going to have a hard time switching over.

 

[PrairrieDogExpress]

I havent' seen the columbia tube. Do you have a link?

 

[McDusty]

facebook page:

http://www.facebook.com/ColumbiaTap...2&set=a.136906243018243.12677.136562456385955

 

[PrairrieDogExpress]

what I dont like about a tube that is too "loose" is that when you lean it against the wall mud leaks out slowly. Not cool.

 

[McDusty]

If you do it with the head down, absolutely yes. made that mistake more than once.