Looking for help testing new tools...

rhardman

The website is up so it's time to end the thread as I told Nathan I would.

We're having some internal conflicts about selling the mesh products to drywall contractors. One guy thinks we can push them and people will buy them. This is a typical marketing tactic which works with mediocre results so we're not going to operate that way. If a tool isn't in high demand, we won't offer it. Like I've said, the mesh tools will first be offered to the plasterers and overseas where they are better suited. When the paper tape tools are ready we'll focus on the drywall community here.

Product Update:

1. Still working on getting the videos done. There always seem to be higher priorities popping up. They will be available on the website.

2. The new Contractor Grade hand tools are coming along well. We'll have a little more time getting them perfected. Price points will be much more in line with what the majority of the industry wants. Along with these tools will be the Man Pan (as A+ has named it) and they will be marketed through traditional channels. The higher grade "Lifetime Guaranteed" tools will be on our website at a higher price. They will be our premier line of tools. Better made, easier to clean with 24/7 customer support (which goes directly to my cell phone).

3. We're perfecting new high pressure valves and seals and still waiting (believe it or not) on the University to tell us how much wear occurred during the 460 hour test to the old seal design. The Raptor pump is the heart of everything new we want to introduce. The taping tools were basically finished by the late 80's; it's been the pump that has been the difficult part. Anyone can build tools to strap to the end of a hose but without a pump designed specifically for the way drywall guys work, it's not going to be enough to change the industry. Without a patented design a mfr is vulnerable to the whims of the company they are purchasing from. In essense they become a sales guy for the pump company with pricing far too high for the average user.

With ideas, great plans and an internal belief that a new tool will change the world, people go to market with their product. Tragically most aren't successful. I think that is because the ideas aren't properly tested first and the designer/company thinks they can make the customer buy what they want to sell. They refuse to listen. The DWT forum has been extremely helpful, confirming many of my thoughts and totally knocking me on my butt when I've needed (deserved) it.

Thank you for your time, comments and suggestions. It's time for us to hit the streets.

I believe our "Raptor" and especially our "Stinger" series of tools will provide a quantum leap in drywall tool technology. I may be wrong; that will be totally up to you.

You should hear more from us early next year.

www.hardmansystems.com

Rick
(I'm not leaving DWT, just ending this thread.)

Tim0282

This has been an interesting thread. One I sure have looked forward to reading every day. Thank you Rick, for your professional input. It has been a great ride and looking forward to your next step.

Kiwiman

No don't go Rick, you mentioned mesh, maybe the debate/brawl will spill over into this room.

rhardman

Since we are holding off from selling anything quite yet I thought I'd post a photo of the earlier Raptor Texture System prototype that gave us the information for the new A-4 version we're finishing up right now. The one pictured started out in our kitchen very small and grew larger and ugly as I found I needed to add more power. This is the unit we tested the new pump design with when we blew the hose a few months ago.
Attachment 379
I met with an engineer today to run the new design past him for possible tweaks before we finalize everything. He couldn't add anything to it, liking everything there. We're setting this one up for drywall and EIFS demos so it will run 2 pumps independently or simultaneously. It will spray paint airless or mud with an on board compressor. Conceivably it could power 2 guys spraying 2 different spray guns at the same time or 2 of your finishing tools at the same time. I can't reveal the hopper/pump yet.

The trailer is an accessory. The machine its self is only about 20 inches tall and can easily fit in the back of a pick up. Note the wheels, they roll through a door easily with only about 20 pounds lifting weight.

Thats 150 feet of hose on the trailer.

A long way from 1985....
HSI 1985 Power Unit #2.jpg

Rick

(patents pending)

Mudstar

I hate to tell you rick what your building has been done like I stated a while back now. I have put together pump that does the same thing and it does what you claim yours will do for costs that no one can touch. I call it my secret weapon and its not going to market until everyone blows there capital first.

Its a dog eat dog world.


Good luck!

rhardman

Mudstar,

You're a great guy and your posts are already welcome. But honestly, you have a tendancy to jump before you have all the facts.

First, you haven't seen anything yet and the fact that even if a similar idea had been tried, success does not come solely from a unique idea but from a superior management team, lower production costs, a better price/benefit matrix and superior customer service. It is developed through better marketing/sales channels and industry relationships.

You say you have a secret weapon. Congratulations! The industry needs any new idea that helps the contractor. Ultimately it is they who will decide what is good and what isn't. We will present what we have and leave our future to the contractors. If we meet their needs, great. If we don't, we thank everyone for their consideration.

Stop being so difficult, sit back and wait to see what's coming before you get all critical. Once we give you the full list of our tools, then attack if that's your decision. Until then, youi're aiming at a moving target.

"It's a dog eat dog world" is not a necessary view for business. I suggest you focus on developing the absolute best pump you can, come up with the best support system for the customer and not worry about the competition. Do the best thing for everyone and don't linger in the negative aspects of the business world. You cannot intimidate competitors and you cannot force business to come to your door.

One last thing, regarding your statement, "its not going to market until everyone blows there capital first." is short sighted and doesn't allow you time to improve your product until much later. If you do have the better mouse trap, get it out there ASAP. You will make mistakes as everyone does and you need the early days to work them all out. Go for it now and be successful now! You deserve to get recognition if you have the next generation solution.

With respect my friend,

Rick

proficient Mudder

Excellent reply Rick, in your last Post.

Bill

rhardman

Thank you Bill.

It's a fun time we all have here. I poked Ames a couple of weeks ago. Nobody ever means any real harm and in the rough and tumble world of drywall, I appreciated the straight forward approach rather than the "professional" demeanor that hides behind a facade of implied superiority.

I love a good scrap. It was my turn to be punched in the nose this time.

The photo's above were not intended to illustrate anything magnificent, just to show that in over 32 years* of trial and error, we are paying our dues in regard to R&D.

Rick
*I should say that this was virtually a solo effort for all those years. It wasn't until we made the meteoric advancement in the pump design 18 months ago that I brought on my partners, Scott (President), Tom (Finance), Cory (Engineering/Design) and Richard (R&D/Mfg). Richard dates back to 1985 helping me with machining at Jerry's shop in Washougal, Washington. I'm the least qualified guy in the room but since I designed everything they are forced to let me hang out with them.

Mudstar

I love your spunk Rick and I like keeping you on your toes. Don't give up

I truly support your efforts and one day will be payday


Cheers

rhardman

This one was designed for large high rise buildings where it will travel up the floors as the project progresses and also for mobile home factory's (factories?). No exhaust fumes. Its a little crude but works great. Just needs about of month of redesign. The hydraulic motor that spins the reel is rudely large. I had it sitting around so I bolted it on. The balance is good but the axle needs addressed as well at its overall style. I want it tall (as it's a stationary unit) so it's easy to attach the different finishing tools to it.

Attachment 381

Rick

Thank you for the note Mudstar, much appreciated

Capt-sheetrock

Lokks cool, looks neat.

I've been spraying ceilings since 1974 and have to this day to see ANY rig that is faster than a guy with a hopper.

Could be wrong, but haven't seen it yet.

JustMe

I don't know how fast your motors are meant to spin your reels, but for the last reel I built for 300' of 3/4" i.d. pressure hose, I used some used cultivator discs on the ends. The curve of the discs helped to keep the hose from 'jumping' over the reel ends while the hose was winding. I could get that thing going pretty good and not have the problem nearly as much as I found straight reel sides could give me.

But that unit was truck mounted. For weight considerations, maybe you could use something like a couple of shallow cooking woks.

Kiwiman

Man thats one mean looking machine, it sort of makes me want to put a seat on it and see what speed it will do...Raptor racing, now there's an advertising gimmick .

rhardman

Granted...

In the 90's I was looking at the robotic tools for taping and finishing (that originated with my dad) and while they offered an entirely new and faster technology, I wanted something that would be a catapult into a new way of doing drywall. Going to a hose would eliminate the refilling of the tools but even with that, we're only talking what....a 30% increase in productivity? I knew that the bulk of the industry would sit back and wait to see what others thought first before they would invest in a system. I never wanted to offer something that wasn't an obvious, "knock everyone on their butt" technology.

I don't want to muddle around in trade shows explaining why a 30% increase in production is worth your hard earned money, I wanted something that everyone said, "He!! yes! Of course!!!" A series of tools that were such an advancement in labor saving that (for those that want to work with us) they have an overwhelming advantage in their bidding prices. Then I decided that we would do direct marketing to the National Association of Home Builders and American Institute of Architects to inform them of the new textures and financial advantages of hiring a contractor using HSI tools. As leads are developed we will send them to our partners in that area and introduce them to the GC's and owners that accept the bids.

But to make this a true industry changing system, we would need to increase productivity by over 100%. This meant that the pumping system(s) had to be better than anything out there and be a completely different design than anyone else is offering and at a lower price. This has been the challenge and the thing that took the longest to perfect. It would have to have virtually no set up/cleaning time and offer a virtual unlimited supply of mud. It would need to pump extremely thick mud for metal and first coat so shrinkage would be minimal and it would also need to be able to pump very thin material for a light orange peel or fog coat texturing.

It would need to pump between .25 gallons - 5 gallons a minute and texture with air so it offers the widest variety of patterns and can also be used for touch up to match old textures from years gone by.

It would also require the ability to paint in an airless mode.

I knew that if I could accomplish a pumping system that would do all this, then anything would be possible. Tool designs are virtually unlimited (swirling texture dobbers, auto-fed mud/metal/texture/skip trowel knives...). With this concept we can open ideas for new tools to every contractor in the country. Have a new idea? We'll use it, offer it, and send you a royalty on every one sold.

I began to fully understand about a year ago (honest and brutal feedback from everyone here at DWT) the true depth of reservation there will be. No matter what is offered, you guys are going to hold off on buying anything unless I prove everything first. I figured that if my tools are what I say they are, I have 2 options. I can either fight with all of the established automatic tool mfrs (head to head) or I can open my power systems (shown in the pictures above) to one main mfr so we can help them develop a CFS system too. We'll promote them, build them up and do what we can to support them. I realize that no matter how successful we may be...the other tools will have devoted customers for the next 20 years. So, it seems obvious that if I could partner up with an existing company (and promote them), then they rise above the other automatic tools mfrs, enjoy a brand new channel to sell their tools (at virtually no cost) and reap the benefits for years to come. I brought this to one of the mfrs 2 weeks ago and was met with a resounding "no." So I'll wait until I have everything on the market, and talk to someone else.

We also need to offer you the abilty to adapt your personal tools to our machine(s) to save you money.

The pictures above show 2 different power units for the pumping systems. The second (for high rise and mobile home projects), while its as fast as a hopper for texturing, what if you could use this machine to do 2 high rise floors at the same time, tape, finish, texture and paint with it in half the time it takes to do the job now? In that context, I think we can offer something special. If not, we have the Raptor A-1 which is our smallest unit that is just as small as a hopper/compressor with virtually no set up and cleaning time.

There are 4 patents which need to be completed before I can share anything specific but let me part with just a few more points...

1. We have to self finance right now. First, in this economic environment, nobody wants to invest in a start up unless they carry the bulk of ownership. This requires more time for us to get out of the gate, but also allows us to wait until everything is perfect before we offer anything for sale. I've been involved with several start ups and when the money people start demanding a return, the quality goes out the window. If sales don't progress as fast as you forecast, you borrow more and lose more of the company. If you have to subject your company to a 3rd round of financing, you can pretty much write off all ownership...patents...and 32 years of your (my) life.

2. I want to offer tools for rent to own, lease and for sale. After we get our footing, I then want to offer stock to any contractor in the world through their local material house. This way you can buy $1000.00 worth of the company and pay it off as your material house allows you. This one is very sticky legally...and it's not totally solved yet, but that's what I want to do.

3. I want to show you a 3D mural system I'm working on that will allow you to create a relief on a wall with actual running water (on a production basis). We advertise to the AIA and NAHB, you receive the lead, do the mural, finish it in 2 days and charge $1800.00 for it.

Then we have completely new tools...a new paint system...and a new kind of mud that I think you are really going to like.

I know this all sounds like insane BS... But you've seen that every new tool I've displayed (whether you liked it or not) is a completely new technology. You've seen that I've been at this since the late 70's and you've seen pictures of actual machines we've already developed.

And I have the best management team (I mentioned before) to provide the experience that I don't have. Scott (Pres) has been involved with large start ups (one receiving $500,000,000.00 from Lucent Technologies as an investment package), and Tom (Finance) beginning and managing many start ups to the $50-$60,000,000.00 level).

I just ask for patience.

As I've said before, if things turn out not to solidify as I intend, I'll be the first to tell you.

Rick
(While competitors will think I'm foolish for presenting part of our plan, it's better understood by the fact that I have full confidence in our technology. We don't worry about competition.)

rhardman

That's a great idea, thanks.

The systems shown were made to prove that my theories would work. Before we sell them, they will go through a design for manufacturability stage where we streamline everything.

Capt-sheetrock

Man I hope you get it figured out,, I was not trying to bash you at all. I am a tool-whore and all I need is to SEE a better tool ONE time, and I'll buy it.

There is ALWAYS a better way to do something, and I hope you figure it out man, really !!!!!!!

rhardman

Captain,

That never entered my mind!

I appreciate that I can receive open input in every flavor. DWT is a microcosim (sp?) of the world.

Keep it coming...please! Whenever I ran out of money to build a new prototype, I worked on the business plan (selling stock only to drywall contractors for example) which pretty much limits our future to my preconceptions. The more I hear from others...the better off we are.

Rick

Capt-sheetrock

Rick, why don't you take a look at the mudrunner by TT, Its a really cool concept for a tool, Its so much better than a corner box,,,,,, however, Its a POS, simple because there is no competion and TT could careless about making it work right. Since no other company is providing an alternative,,,,,,,

Whoever comes up with the new and improved mudrunner will get 100% of the mudrunner bussiness.

Just a thought

rhardman

Captain,

That's easy, and is already done.
Want to run that and a nail spotter at the same time?
How about a 24 or 36 inch box that you can skim a wall with?

Remember...an unlimited flow of mud allows you to do anything. AND...you get a free texture machine.

There's more...

Rick
I have to go pick Francesca up at the studio. Have a great night.

JustMe

Thanks. It's an idea, anyway. How great it would be for your system, I don't know.

In my case, that hose was being rewound probably 10 times a day on average for what I was using it for, so that custom reel carrier was an investment to me - more work got done, so more money got made.

But I built it based on my experience with such situations. It's what I thought I should have. If I hadn't had that experience, I very likely would've opted for a standard, cheaper off the shelf carrier. As they say in marketing, people don't necessarily buy what they need. They buy what they think they need.