Finishing Butt Joints

 
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Old 11-24-2010, 07:11 PM   #1
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Finishing Butt Joints


Have had different ways shown to me but what is the best way to finish Butt Joints in the most effiecient way? Do you just go over twice w/ a 12" bowed trowel or make a mud path on both sides of the tape one your first coat and then a mud path over the tape itslef on your second coat then what?

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Old 11-24-2010, 10:02 PM   #2
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


You could get 6 people to answer this and get 6 different answers on ways to do it. Some people run a box on each side of the tape for the first coat and then down the middle on the second and there done. As far as a bowed Trowel goes, I would say there are no good, you need a straight one. You could coat each side of the tape with your trowel for the first coat and on the second go over it all coating it a little wider with less mud. Its basically a preference thing I'd say.
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Old 11-24-2010, 10:17 PM   #3
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


When coating by hand i use a 12" flat to load the butt(both sides), then wipe it down with my 20"...no lap marks. Second coat use my 14", and wipe with the 20"....done. Maybe a light sand to lose any float ridges and blend the edges. If the butt is severe, I'll use my homemade 36" bull float trowel with welded handles and still have only a two coat butt.

I've actually heard good things about the curved trowels (bowed), I've just never bought one.
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Old 11-24-2010, 10:26 PM   #4
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


git-r-dun is right,except for the curve trowel part.I call the curve trowel the poor mans box without the numbers.just think about how boxes run,there's a arch in the blade.(adjustable arch)if your good with the trowel,you can fool SOME people that you were using boxes.
but I would drop down to a 10" curve trowel,till you can afford 10" boxes,12" too big(I'm assuming your running flats with it too)there's lots of reading on this site about butts ,just grab a beer or 2 and start reading,
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Old 11-24-2010, 10:31 PM   #5
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


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there's lots of reading on this site about butts ,just grab a beer or 2 and start reading,
2Buck...I thought you left this site to do research on butts
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Old 11-24-2010, 10:48 PM   #6
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


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Originally Posted by SlimPickins View Post
When coating by hand i use a 12" flat to load the butt(both sides), then wipe it down with my 20"...no lap marks. Second coat use my 14", and wipe with the 20"....done. Maybe a light sand to lose any float ridges and blend the edges. If the butt is severe, I'll use my homemade 36" bull float trowel with welded handles and still have only a two coat butt.

I've actually heard good things about the curved trowels (bowed), I've just never bought one.
just curious,why such big trowels,are you a very big man or something,with big arms.If so I will call you sir slimpickins.don't you get a lot of ripples,skip marks,waves,or what ever you call them,the bigger the trowel the harder it is to push,the smaller the trowel the more SPEED you can get (which is what you want) .there's some misconception that plaster guys used big honking trowels to get their work level which is not the case at all.then guys carry this theory over to taping.
think of the machines (boxes) their 7,8,10,12,inches,a trowel that is any bigger than that is going to wreck your shoulders,wrist,or elbow down the road,and your coating will be smoother ,speed stroke your coats,not big coat.
just trying to save your arms
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Old 11-24-2010, 10:49 PM   #7
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


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2Buck...I thought you left this site to do research on butts
i will be,but not the butts were talking about
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Old 11-25-2010, 05:22 AM   #8
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


10 inch curve towel. A must in any tapers bucket!
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Old 11-25-2010, 07:58 AM   #9
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


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Originally Posted by SlimPickins View Post
When coating by hand i use a 12" flat to load the butt(both sides), then wipe it down with my 20"...no lap marks. Second coat use my 14", and wipe with the 20"....done. Maybe a light sand to lose any float ridges and blend the edges. If the butt is severe, I'll use my homemade 36" bull float trowel with welded handles and still have only a two coat butt.

I've actually heard good things about the curved trowels (bowed), I've just never bought one.
Slim' I do the same exact method; only I use a 10 inch to spread the material both times. My 20 inch blade is very old.. and I will be very sad when it is no good anymore .. very protective of that knife.. Anyway Happy Thanksgiving... I'm up early with nothing to do' and the kids are still sleeping' And yes Captain they will always be kids to me,,Sometimes it is a bit scary for me to call my son a kid.. Ha!

Last edited by betterdrywall; 11-25-2010 at 08:04 AM.
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Old 11-25-2010, 10:35 AM   #10
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


Quote:
Originally Posted by 2buckcanuck View Post
just curious,why such big trowels,are you a very big man or something,with big arms.If so I will call you sir slimpickins.don't you get a lot of ripples,skip marks,waves,or what ever you call them,the bigger the trowel the harder it is to push,the smaller the trowel the more SPEED you can get (which is what you want) .there's some misconception that plaster guys used big honking trowels to get their work level which is not the case at all.then guys carry this theory over to taping.
think of the machines (boxes) their 7,8,10,12,inches,a trowel that is any bigger than that is going to wreck your shoulders,wrist,or elbow down the road,and your coating will be smoother ,speed stroke your coats,not big coat.
just trying to save your arms
I'm not that big, 6' 3", about 210 lbs. I started running a 20" mainly to bridge big spreads between beads so I didn't have a big honking ridge down the center. Then I used it one time to smooth a butt, and I was sold. I find that wide knives leave ripples etc, but my trowels leave things quite smooth. There's a guy who I work with frequently who used to get irate at my large trowels ("don't pull that thing out on MY job!"), and he's been finishing for about 30 years.....and then the other day he says "I think I might have to go and get one of those 20" trowels". There comes a point where you're faster if you slow down
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Old 11-25-2010, 10:37 AM   #11
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


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Slim' I do the same exact method; only I use a 10 inch to spread the material both times. My 20 inch blade is very old.. and I will be very sad when it is no good anymore .. very protective of that knife.. Anyway Happy Thanksgiving... I'm up early with nothing to do' and the kids are still sleeping' And yes Captain they will always be kids to me,,Sometimes it is a bit scary for me to call my son a kid.. Ha!
Happy Thanksgiving!

I'm so protective of my trowels it borders on ridiculous!
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Old 11-25-2010, 06:53 PM   #12
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


Happy thanksgiving guys,,,,

My take on butts is this,,,,,

Run em till they are flat !!!!!!! period.

Some (most) can be done in two coats,,,, some (a small few)take 6 or 7 coats.
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Old 11-25-2010, 07:31 PM   #13
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


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some (a small few)take 6 or 7 coats.
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Old 11-25-2010, 09:24 PM   #14
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


I have the rockers power plane the beams any butt joints there r as they use 16 footers mostly and some twelves so minimal butts. But u simply run a 7 then 12 down the middle same as flats!! 2 days time good luck!!
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Old 11-26-2010, 01:31 AM   #15
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


Not every butt is this same

10"box on each side , 12" on each side, 12" down middle, cross off and check with 14"knife
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Old 11-26-2010, 05:29 PM   #16
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


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Some (most) can be done in two coats,,,, some (a small few)take 6 or 7 coats.
The taper I'm working with is doing a side job. The home owner did a bathroom of his own awhile ago, and it took him 5 boxes of mud to do it.

The home owner got started on another area of his house, and then decided he didn't want to go through that again. So he hired my fellow taper.

Butt joints and knife coating: Once up the middle with a 10" knife, to load it/make sure there's enough on top of the tape, and give a flat center. Then 2 up the sides, with about a 3" spacing, to load the sides - but I don't feather those too much, at least at the beginning. I let the end of the knife furthest from the tape float some, to make sure there's enough mud to work with after, and so I don't peak the center. Then I work out the excess mud, starting by running the knife down each side, but overlapping them a few inches in the middle, to clean things up. I leave those runs fairly level, not tapering too much yet. As I move out to the edges to clean things up, I start tapering. But I don't worry too much about feathering the edges right out, if they're a touch high. The next coat will be a little wider, pretty much by doing the same thing as the 1st coat, but using a 12" knife. I'll feather out the edges on the 2nd coat.

Butt joints and boxing: With paper tape, 10 or 12" down the sides 1st, depending on situation. Then 10" or 12" down the middle, depending on which is handiest at the time, after the sides have dried. After that's dried, skim out with knife.

If using FibaFuse, I've started running 10" down the middle 1st, because the blade tears fibers from the Fiba, if I go down the sides 1st. Then after drying, 10 or 12" down the sides, depending on situation. Then after that dries, skim coat with knife.

Last edited by JustMe; 11-26-2010 at 06:48 PM.
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Old 11-26-2010, 06:54 PM   #17
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


Whats up with the naming of coats after you guys tape you all talk about first coating the butt seam. Don't you tapers out there realize the first coat is the tape coat then after that it is the second coat???? What do you consider the tape coat 0 coat? Good Grief I know most just call it a tape coat but I always learned to also call it the first coat.
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Old 11-26-2010, 06:56 PM   #18
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


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The taper I'm working with is doing a side job. The home owner did a bathroom of his own awhile ago, and it took him 5 boxes of mud to do it.

The home owner got started on another area of his house, and then decided he didn't want to go through that again. So he hired my fellow taper.

Butt joints and knife coating: Once up the middle with a 10" knife, to load it/make sure there's enough on top of the tape, and give a flat center. Then 2 up the sides, with about a 3" spacing, to load the sides - but I don't feather those too much, at least at the beginning. I let the end of the knife furthest from the tape float some, to make sure there's enough mud to work with after, and so I don't peak the center. Then I work out the excess mud, starting by running the knife down each side, but overlapping them a few inches in the middle, to clean things up. I leave those runs fairly level, not tapering too much yet. As I move out to the edges to clean things up, I start tapering. But I don't worry too much about feathering the edges right out, if they're a touch high. The next coat will be a little wider, pretty much by doing the same thing as the 1st coat, but using a 12" knife. I'll feather out the edges on the 2nd coat.

Butt joints and boxing: With paper tape, 10 or 12" down the sides 1st, depending on situation. Then 10" or 12" down the middle, depending on which is handiest at the time, after the sides have dried. After that's dried, skim out with knife.

If using FibaFuse, I've started running 10" down the middle 1st, because the blade tears fibers from the Fiba, if I go down the sides 1st. Then after drying, 10 or 12" down the sides, depending on situation. Then after that dries, skim coat with knife.
Another reason to not use fibafuse or should we call it fibatear
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Old 11-26-2010, 07:31 PM   #19
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


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Originally Posted by silverstilts View Post
Whats up with the naming of coats after you guys tape you all talk about first coating the butt seam. Don't you tapers out there realize the first coat is the tape coat then after that it is the second coat???? What do you consider the tape coat 0 coat? Good Grief I know most just call it a tape coat but I always learned to also call it the first coat.
Taping the butt seam is the 1st coat? If so, I won't argue. It doesn't matter to me what it's called.

Quote:
Originally Posted by silverstilts View Post
Another reason to not use fibafuse or should we call it fibatear
Tear, sometimes, when used in ways it doesn't seem well enough designed for - at least not well enough designed for to me. In the right places, right instances, I'm finding I'm liking it better than paper. Like today.

Last edited by JustMe; 11-27-2010 at 06:55 AM.
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Old 11-27-2010, 10:06 AM   #20
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Re: Finishing Butt Joints


Silver, its just in a name I guess. Ive never called taping 1st coat, but it is what it is.
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