Confused Apprentices

Taped Crusader

Anyone else here have thier apprentice decide that being the boss is far too easy and overpaid, and go off on thier own? He worked with me for about two years and from my perspective, I treated him a little too good. Paid vacation and substantial bonuses among other things. For the last few months his work began to get REALLY sloppy and I was always having to clean it up. Then when I sit him down to have a talk about his quality, he up and quits on me.

It's been about a month now and from what I hear, things aren't going so hot for him. I imagine that soon I'll be getting a phone call with him looking for a job. Maybe not the best idea to go on your own with no contacts during the slowest construction period in two decades.

silverstilts

Would you take him back is the next question ? Sometimes when someone quits on you only to find out it isn't all gravy out there and people just don't hand out money to you and want their job back things usually will never be the same ... In the back of his mind he may have the attitude that he can quit anytime he feels he is right and you are wrong.. on the other hand it may be to your advantage .... but usually once a guy gets a taste of working on his own even if things don't work out he may decide to stick it out through the rough times . We all have had our starts somewhere , we all know what it takes to stay self-employed and what is the deciding factor is the drive in ourselves .... It is a dirty shame though the amount of time involved with training , the time it involves fixing up mistakes , and the frustrations that comes with an apprentice only to have him leave... what would happen if you hired him back and you were so busy only to have him quit and leave you high and dry ? Have had it happen to me only once and it will never happen again . I have one guy now because things aren't at full swing for us took another job , which I have no problem with ( have to pay the bills ) but it is also to my advantage because the job he is working on now will make him realize that he has to be on time all the time , something he just can't seem to realize working for me even after all the talks we have had ... he has called me twice in the last month wanting to come back because he is sick of his current job . Sometimes they just don't know how good they have it ...

Custom Drywall Svc.

Ooh.....never burn bridges.

Yea, he may definitely be calling back looking for a job. It's self admittedly almost BETTER to be working for someone else right now, the way things are.

This is the classic story....."employee thinks its easy to be the boss."

I myself, and all of us in this position have ranted on this for days before on this forum, on WHY this 'employee mentality' is stupid.

not much more that needs to be said that is not already obvious of how wrong employees are for thinking this.

Whitey97

I deal with this daily. I think mine does it just to get me excited in the am

Taped Crusader

Funny thing is, when he told me he was quitting I told him good luck and I couldn't blame a guy for trying to make a better life for himself. Then I called him later to ask what he wanted to do about the 1K he was into me for. I offered to set up a payment plan since I knew he didn't have that kind of money readily available. This is where things really got interesting. He tells me that he'll cut me a check as he figures he owes me about $80. I get a pretty good chuckle out of that and tell him I'm anxious to see where he came up with that number. The next day his wife calls me up and tells me she wants to drop a check off. Suddenly, I'm the bad guy. Enclosed is a check for $628(not sure where that number came from) and a three page hate letter. Nice. Hell, I got so sick of giving my guy bonuses I sent his wife to the day spa for the full treatment. That's what I get.
So, I'd say the bridge is effectively BURNT. Was pretty sad though, to do my best to make sure his family was taken care of and have it turn out like that. I've only had a handful of employees and I think for now I'm done with em'.

Whitey97

If you wanna send my wife to the spa, I'll come over there and work for ya a bit. It would be a win-win for her, she gets rid of me, and gets a trip to the spa! HA!

silverstilts

don't you just like giving money away , had a guy work for me a while back and his truck went to pieces he had only work about a month for me and yet was in need of money , he couldn't get a loan and i didn't want to cosign so i paid over 4 grand outright to buy him a truck yes his intentions were good on paying me back but never seemed to have enough money and i really didn't want to deduct from his paycheck .... things went down hill after he got the truck , he started calling me in the middle of the night all tuned up complaining about everything and how bad his life was ... I told him not to bother me anymore with his problems and just deal with them like we all have too, within a couple of weeks his work ethics change for the worst showing up late all buzzed up and leaving early to go hit the sauce . I ended up firing him and he got the truck out of the deal ..... It is nice to be able to help out those that really need it and are grateful for the help but the ones that take it for granted its another story , I also help one of my guys out by paying all his child back support to the tune of over $6000 to get him current and do away with the stress only to have him steal from me , I stopped being mister nice guy and only give out what is deserved because in the end I wont go without or my family just to be a nice guy and get walked on.

LSDrywall

Now I can't comment on your personal situations as I don't know all the details, but what I do know is.... I am good at what I do often better than the bosses who hire others. I do not hit the bar after work drink all night and come in boozed up. I have all my own tools and a great reputation to go with them. Why on earth would I want to work for someone else? Nobody hear offers benefits of any kind. should I get paid $10 an hour while my boss simply bills $25? should I work for 10 cents a foot while someone bills 20 for my work? The point is its a descision everyone can make, yes some take advantage, both employers and employee's but thank god I have the choice between working for myself or working for someone else. Some contractors know that if they pay the best and treat thier employees the best they will get and keep the best employee's If you are getting the worst employee's ..........which came first the chicken or the egg?

LS

silverstilts

good common sense is that if a boss pays 10 per hour he should bill out at least double if not triple for the extras that the employee does not have to shell out of pocket such as insurance ( work comp ) liability insurance , materials , also not to mention social security he must have to kick in , plus the unemployment the state has mandated , so of coarse the boss has to charge out more and then to make a small profit for all the headaches involved with a successful business not to mention all the run around time and all the people skills needed to end a working deal with all the legal issues , so why not bill out more than what you pay the employee ... and given the wage at only $10 per hr what do you really think it cost if the wage is set at perhaps $20-$25 per hr ... the money does not go into the bosses pocket unless of course he is not a legit contractor ...

LSDrywall

Silver stilts I should clarify by “here” I meant my local not those of us on the forum. And also I have been on both sides of the fence being an employer and an employee. I did not go into detail about overhead expenses as you pointed out I should have sorry. When I said pay me 10 and bill 20 I meant that as profit. 10 for me 10 for his profit not overhead and materials I should have said 10 for me 10 for profit and x for overhead. Yes I believe if you take the risk and mange things you are should earn some profit but where I live and am from people sometimes can be way to greedy.
LS

Whitey97

is professor spell-check going to have to come out again?

LSDrywall

Ok I deserve that, however if you knew what I was dealing with you might cut me some slack. Look up Diabetic retinopathy, my eyes are bleeding from the inside. I will go back and edit ASAP. I can’t see what I am typing all that well, but will correct anything from here on out.

LS

Darren@Partners

Am always astounded by those who think a contractor, drywall or otherwise, who makes a profit is "greedy". We have had margins eroded so much in the past couple of years, the hourly or footage personnel are guaranteed to be paid, on Friday. Meantime, the contractor has paid them from working capital, waits weeks or months to collect, often servicing a line of credit, etc., usually secured by assets. Have begun to view job costs as a "loan" to subs and suppliers. My "profit" is interest on said loan.

I'll go ahead and overstate the obvious. The contractor also typically has at least a low six figure investment in capital and a priceless amount in reputation. Does the sub/employee have anything at stake beyond a weeks wages?

Let's also not forget the cost of training that worker. Or the potential damage a worker can inflict upon the contractor and his/her reputation if the worker doesn't perform. Oh yeah, the worker gets to call
it a day once the tools are back on the truck.

Does the worker reimburse the contractor when he f's up 4 sheets before lunch or oversands every corner in oneend of the house? Does he expect to be paid the same on every job, regardless of the contractor's margin? My point is that the worker has virtually no skin in the game. And some are just not cut out to do anything else but work hourly or by the foot.

Profit is not a dirty word. Ungratefulness is.

__________________
www.partnersconstruction-drywall.com

Taped Crusader

Darren - I'd like to award you 3 MY HERO points.

silverstilts

could not have expressed it any better . point taken and so true .

Whitey97

couldn't agree any more or have said it better myself. wow!

Stormy_Ny

Give me a break ...... My goodness did you leave out any stereotypical cliche's.

Whitey97

Boo!

Taped Crusader

Stormy - I believe one cliche was left out. "You may not like to hear it, but it's the truth."

Whitey97

Do you guys ever have no call-no shows? My guy did it to me 3 days in a row last week inspite of his normal once a week. I finally had enough.... To the soup line he goes.....